Yet another USB Gecko clone

Portables, case replacements, mods etc, all in here!
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Streetwalker
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Re: Yet another USB Gecko clone

Post by Streetwalker » Sat Nov 03, 2018 12:36 am

I haven't tried HBC as I don't even have a Wii, but that shouldn't be the problem. You could give Swiss a try, it will output debugging information over slot B (must be enabled first). If the FTDI shows up on USB then it's working. Flashing it only changes some information in the descriptor that isn't relevant to proper functionality.
qwerty123
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Re: Yet another USB Gecko clone

Post by qwerty123 » Fri Nov 09, 2018 11:27 am

How would I make USB Gecko? Is it even possible in 2018? If so, please can you tell me where I can buy the parts. Can you use any XC9572xl or does it have to be a specific one? Thanks
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Streetwalker
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Re: Yet another USB Gecko clone

Post by Streetwalker » Fri Nov 09, 2018 1:15 pm

Everything you asked is listed in the OP.
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Re: Yet another USB Gecko clone

Post by qwerty123 » Fri Nov 09, 2018 2:25 pm

What is the OP? Thanks for the quick reply.

Edit: Oh, it means original post.
Some items aren't on Farnell anymore so can I buy them anywhere else, thanks.
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Re: Yet another USB Gecko clone

Post by Cameron_MKW » Sat Apr 06, 2019 12:46 pm

-deleted-
Last edited by Cameron_MKW on Sun Apr 19, 2020 12:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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StarkNebula
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Re: Yet another USB Gecko clone

Post by StarkNebula » Sat Feb 22, 2020 2:36 am

I would appreciate if someone could more accurately outline the specifics of the CPLD (and perhaps USB controller for good measure too) for anyone trying to build their own. The original post lacks any specifics about the part in question. Farnell no longer lists the item on their site. Wayback Machine would/does not work because the site fetches from a database. I emailed support a week ago with the part and Farnell number provided but have not heard back.

That being said, I am trying to find the specifics myself. I can only use my judgement with the information provided to try and guess what it is. I may have found some parts that is the same or matches the specifications based purely on the shoestring information and images in this thread. My understanding is these are the significant specs needed:
  • XC9500XL series chip, specifically XC9572XL
  • 44pin TQFP/VQFP package (surface mount)
  • Voltage range includes 3.3v (would use the 3.3v from the GC Memory Card port)
  • Delay time: 10ns (shorter delays exist, is this critical?)
  • 72 Macrocells (assumed correct since it likely identifies the part number, XL9572XL)
  • 4 logic elements/blocks (or more?)
  • 1600 gates (or more?)
If correct, there are a few results on Digikey that satisfy the requirements. Prices range due to operating temperature and nanosecond delay times.

10ns variants 7.5ns variants Any confirmation from someone with either the knowledge or that has previously acquired the required CPLD and can read their markings on the chip (the images in this thread do not help with that one) or has the datasheet would be immensely appreciated.
Last edited by StarkNebula on Sat Feb 22, 2020 10:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.
mj_judge
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Re: Yet another USB Gecko clone

Post by mj_judge » Sat Feb 22, 2020 9:20 pm

StarkNebula wrote:
Sat Feb 22, 2020 2:36 am
I would appreciate if someone could more accurately outline the specifics of the CPLD (and perhaps USB controller for good measure too) for anyone trying to build their own. The original post lacks any specifics about the part in question. Farnell no longer lists the item on their site. Wayback Machine would/does not work because the site fetches from a database. I emailed support a week ago with the part and Farnell number provided but have not heard back.

That being said, I am trying to find the specifics myself. I can only use my judgement with the information provided to try and guess what it is. I may have found some parts that is the same or matches the specifications based purely on the shoestring information and images in this thread. My understanding is these are the significant specs needed:
  • XC9500XL series chip, specifically XC9572XL
  • 44pin TQFP/VQFP package (surface mount)
  • Voltage range includes 3.3v (would use the 3.3v from the GC Memory Card port)
  • Delay time: 10ns (shorter delays exist, is this critical?)
  • 72 Macrocells (assumed correct since it likely identifies the part number, XL9572XL)
  • 4 logic elements/blocks (or more?)
  • 1600 gates (or more?)

If correct, there are a few results on Digikey that satisfy the requirements. Prices range due to operating temperature and nanosecond delay times.

10ns variants 7.5ns variants
Any confirmation from someone with either the knowledge or that has previously acquired the required CPLD and can read their markings on the chip (the images in this thread do not help with that one) or has the datasheet would be immensely appreciated.
https://wiibrew.org/wiki/USB_Gecko

have you had a look here, there is a lot of information about how it works.
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StarkNebula
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Re: Yet another USB Gecko clone

Post by StarkNebula » Sat Feb 22, 2020 10:30 pm

mj_judge wrote:
Sat Feb 22, 2020 9:20 pm
https://wiibrew.org/wiki/USB_Gecko

have you had a look here, there is a lot of information about how it works.
Thanks mj_judge. I haven't been on that page in a long time. The information helped shed some light on the device itself but doesn't fully address the concern I have which is that the layman will not be able to build a USB Gecko without specifics on the CPLD. The classic USB Gecko in the link is a 100pin package and has flash memory on the board, both not part of the design of the one in this thread. The CPLD is also some 17$USD based on a quick search (https://www.mouser.ca/ProductDetail/Int ... a%2FwQKw==).

However, it lead me to narrow down a few things. What I learned and can infer is:
  • The original CPLD has 440 Macrocells, USB Gecko likely uses much less
  • The original CPLD had 57 Logic Element/Blocks, USB Gecko likely uses much less
  • The operating temperature is 0C to 70C
  • Propagation delay of 5.4ns. "The delay specification in a CPLD is the maximum (i.e. worst case) pin-to-pin delay. That is, the maximum delay it takes for a signal "edge" to propagate from any pin to any other pin through the internal (combinational) logic." (source on StackExchange)
That shortlists the parts I think are compatible to these 2. If I had to guess, I would think either works but would play it safe and grab the one with less delay.
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Re: Yet another USB Gecko clone

Post by mj_judge » Tue Feb 25, 2020 10:32 am

StarkNebula wrote:
Sat Feb 22, 2020 2:36 am
I would appreciate if someone could more accurately outline the specifics of the CPLD (and perhaps USB controller for good measure too) for anyone trying to build their own. The original post lacks any specifics about the part in question. Farnell no longer lists the item on their site. Wayback Machine would/does not work because the site fetches from a database. I emailed support a week ago with the part and Farnell number provided but have not heard back.
hey sorry I was half asleep when I replied to this, I realise you are trying to rebuild one of these clone devices and not re-create the official one.

https://www.xilinx.com/support/document ... /ds057.pdf

Heres the datasheet to the CPLD, I presume you have it? the specific one quotes was the XC9572XL-10VQG44C (This corresponds to 1605849 that used to be available from farnells)

XC9572XL-10VQG44C 10 ns VQG44 44-pin Quad Flat Pack (VQFP); Pb-free C

Do you need the datasheet for the 245 usb controller? there a fairly off the shelf chip.

C is commerical (i.e C = Commercial: TA = 0° to +70°C;)



hth
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StarkNebula
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Re: Yet another USB Gecko clone

Post by StarkNebula » Wed Feb 26, 2020 3:20 am

Thanks mj_judge! It turns out the part I had listed on Digi-Key is the same. Glad you could confirm that as I know some of the other questions in this thread relate to part specifics. If you don't mind throwing up the datasheet for the other part that would be nice for any future readers. That one is a least easier to be confident in when searching online.

For those future readers, it looks like XC9572XL-10VQG44C is the CPLD to look for. I would recommend viewing the opening post as there are specifics on how to program these chips.
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Re: Yet another USB Gecko clone

Post by mj_judge » Wed Feb 26, 2020 6:47 pm

https://bg.farnell.com/ftdi/ft245rl/int ... dp/1146034

datasheet and overview is there for the ft245, some years ago ftdi drivers messed with the eeprom of cloned chips (you can get many usb clone chips for almost free) so if using a clone be careful what drivers you use, im not sure if the current ones do
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Streetwalker
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Re: Yet another USB Gecko clone

Post by Streetwalker » Sat Apr 18, 2020 12:37 pm

I've heard some were having trouble programming the FTDI with MProg. Since MProg is deprecated, I've added a programming file for FT_Prog which is the newer, still supported tool (this was already the case when I originally made this post, I just never bothered to provide and updated file because MProg worked for me :P).
Cameron_MKW
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Re: Yet another USB Gecko clone

Post by Cameron_MKW » Sun Apr 19, 2020 12:23 pm

Oh, great! Thanks for that, it worked first time no hassle.
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Streetwalker
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Re: Yet another USB Gecko clone

Post by Streetwalker » Mon Apr 20, 2020 5:37 am

You're welcome. :)
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StarkNebula
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Re: Yet another USB Gecko clone

Post by StarkNebula » Thu Jul 09, 2020 2:34 am

I've been trying to get my boards programmed and I'm having the hardest time getting anything to work. I had spent a week finagling with various JTAG programmers and Arduino XSVF players with no luck so I bought one of the knock-off XILINX programmers from AliExpress (which arrived today). While it has seemingly gotten me farther I keep getting an error in IMPACT "A problem may exist in the hardware configuration. Check that the cable, scan chain, and power connections are intact, that the specified scan chain configuration matches the actual hardware, and that the power supply is adequate and delivering the correct voltage."

What I've found online isn't helping as the version of IMPACT that came with the programmer crashes when I try to debug the scan chain (both 32- and 64-bit versions, running Windows 10 x64). I'm currently downloading the newer tool chain (31GB!) which feels like using a flamethrower to light a candle.

In any case, I would appreciate it if someone who has Done It™ could explain the process of flashing a CPLD and the rationale behind why certain steps are involved. It's frustrating because plugging a USB cable in and twiddling some bits shouldn't have to be this convoluted.
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Re: Yet another USB Gecko clone

Post by emu_kidid » Thu Jul 09, 2020 3:04 am

I have done it, I typically have the PCB in the GameCube memory card slot with the power turned on when programming since my xilinx platform cable knockoff (and real ones?) don't power the device by default.
Image
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Re: Yet another USB Gecko clone

Post by StarkNebula » Thu Jul 09, 2020 3:23 am

Thanks for the reply! I find that a strange choice but presume it provides flexibility in device power requirements. I should probably take the time to read the manual to learn these things. Good to know!

Edit: I didn't notice before but the pinout is indeed Vref and not Vcc which makes a lot of sense. I'm running into different issues now with IMPACT 14.7 but it's still a step up. It seems more actionable. I'll have more time to dig into this during the weekend. Thanks again for the tip!
INFO:iMPACT - Current time: 2020-07-08 11:50:18 PM

Unsupported command - validateInstance invoked
, Please make sure that the command is supported on this device.

Unsupported command - getBypassInfo invoked
, Please make sure that the command is supported on this device.
Unsupported command - validateInstance invoked
, Please make sure that the command is supported on this device.
Unsupported command - checkIDCode invoked
, Please make sure that the command is supported on this device.
Unsupported command - getBypassInfo invoked
, Please make sure that the command is supported on this device.
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